Santa Cruz shoot out – Tallboy 3 vs. Tallboy 5
High noon on the Peaslake hills (literally, it was a smoking 30°c) saw the new Santa Cruz Tallboy Mk5 go head-to-head with my beloved Tallboy Mk3 for the short travel trail bike space in my garage.
I had arranged with ACE cycles in Gomshall to take a new Santa Cruz Tallboy Mk5 out for a demo day. I took along my Tallboy Mk3 so I could ride them back to back on the same trails for a true test.
I am glad I did as impressions on the trail did not always accord with the data when I checked up on Strava later.
First some context
I had the original Santa Cruz Hightower and loved it, and then bought a Hightower 2 when it came out with the lower linkage shock. As suggested by reviews, I assumed it would be even better. Alas, longer, slacker, heavier with more travel did not equal more fun on the trails for me.
My concern was it would be the same with the Tallboy, hence wanting to do a head-to-head comparison before making any change.
So let’s compare numbers between the Tallboy Mk3 and the Tallboy Mk5.
| Size XL | Tallboy Mk3 | Tallboy Mk5 |
|---|---|---|
| Reach | Tallboy Mk3 475mm | Tallboy Mk5 495mm |
| Head angle | Tallboy Mk3 68° | Tallboy Mk5 66° |
| Seat angle | Tallboy Mk3 73° | Tallboy Mk5 77° |
| Wheelbase | Tallboy Mk3 1195mm | Tallboy Mk5 1257mm |
| Rear travel | Tallboy Mk3 110mm | Tallboy Mk5 120mm |
As we’ve heard many times with modern bike geometry – longer, slacker, more travel and… heavier.
I was surprised to find that despite the Reach figure growing 20mm and a much longer wheelbase, the Tallboy Mk5 turns out to have a shorter cockpit than the Mk3 thanks to the steep seat angle and slacker head angle. I pushed the seat right back on the rails on my ultra blue test bike and it was still a smidge shorter than the Tallboy Mk3.
My route
The route chosen was the climb from Walking Bottom carpark to El Capitan, down El Capitan via the rootier of the descent options, then climb up to and down the Nova’s.
Switch bikes, and repeat.
Then up the Barry Knows Best rocky climb and down BKB, again repeated with both bikes. I also took the Tallboy Mk5 across for some Holmbury trails (Yogurt Pots, Crackpipe, Telegraph Road) but did not have the energy to repeat this on the Tallboy Mk3 (did I mention it was 30°c?!).
Ride impressions of the Santa Cruz Tallboy 3 vs. the Tallboy 5
First some climbing
On the trail the steeper seat angle of the Tallboy Mk5 kept the front end under control and it climbed efficiently. But it did feel heavier and therefore harder work than the Tallboy Mk3. I would have said it was slower.
However, looking at data, the Tallboy Mk5 was as quick or a bit quicker up the climbs. At first I was puzzled, but actually it’s not such a mystery. I was simply working harder to keep up my cadence and so matching the Tallboy Mk3 speedwise, but at the expense of more energy used.
Then coming back down
This is not an easy comparison as familiarity and confidence come into play here.
On the trails I mostly ride, the Tallboy Mk3 just feels so light and at ease, it is emminently chuckable. I don’t really have to think much as it seems to pop up and over trail features of its own accord, taking off and landing cleanly time after time. Errors in line are easily corrected – it is just a lot of easily accessible fun.
The Tallboy Mk5 rides to a different geometry. It felt sure-footed, planted and dealt with the trails with ease, far more capable than me (as with most bikes). So far so good.
However, I had to concentrate more to put the bike in the right place. This resulted in a few heart-in-mouth moments when I did not hit trail features quite as planned. Instead of getting set up for and executing little jumps, I found I was pumping and rolling through rather than popping up, off and over things.
The Tallboy Mk5 was quicker downhill – not by much but consistently quicker – than the Tallboy Mk3, but I needed to work harder for that pace. Pumping and rolling is faster but it’s less fun (although I have to allow some of this would be due to my familiarity with the Tallboy Mk3).
Summary
Overall, the Tallboy Mk5 does what it was designed to be – more of a trail bike than an XC-oriented short travel bike. So faster going down, but harder work going up than the (relatively) more XC Tallboy Mk3. No surprise there.
Like a lot of things, whether that is better or not depends on many factors. The Tallboy Mk5 would be great if it was my only trail bike or if my other bike was a big rig like a Nomad, leaving a lot of trail room for the Tallboy Mk5 to slot into.
However, I have the Hightower LT that is supremely capable across a wide range of trails, leaving little room in my garage for a Tallboy Mk5. The more XC-oriented but very trail capable Tallboy Mk3 is a better companion to the Hightower LT than the Tallboy Mk5. The fact that it is more fun downhill and easier to pedal up makes this an easy choice for me.
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Lloyd says:
Given direction of bike development, I think the Blur TR may be a better comparison / replacement for the Tallboy 3 then the newer Tallboy with lower linkage design
Maybe that is the next test?
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Posted on September 6, 2023 at 10:46 am
Matt says:
I sense you really want to spend your money Lloyd! But Blur TR could definitely be that bike with a slightly longer wheelbase than the Tallboy 3.
The only thing to note – and why try before you buy is so important – is it loses a set of pivots at the rear, so quite a different suspension system. A quality shock may need to be factored in.
I reckon the Tallboy 5 is actually more like my Bird Aether which needs the rider to be reasonably active to get the most out of it’s geometry (not as active as I was the other day!). That would make sense if it was your only bike, but I can see why it’s far too close to the Hightower LT to be worthwhile.
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Posted on September 6, 2023 at 11:59 am
Elliot says:
I’m fairly sure, obviously without having ridden a newer Santa Cruz, that the steeper seat tube would have swung it for me. Didn’t get on with being so far back on my Mk1 Hightower. But I can totally understand the old model feeling more fun.
Definitely try the Blur instead. Might have to (shock horror) look at alternative brands otherwise 😲
I do find it odd how many new products aren’t actually better than the old ones. Most recently got newly redesigned Ergon grips. Except they’re uglier and less comfortable because the rubber is harder. The old ones were perfect.
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Posted on September 6, 2023 at 5:43 pm
Daniel says:
Lloyd, Love seeing this review. Tradition holds that reviews are meant to pit current models against each other.
But, noting the bike industry direction of longer/slacker/heavier (several decades of this), we may have bypassed the ‘sweet spot’.
I’ve been riding a V1 Hightower cc xo rsv since 2018. Size large 135/140 travel, 29.1 lbs with spd’s, bottle cage, garmin and light mounts.
Been searching for a new, better trail bike for a few years. Hoping for similar or improved performance at a lighter weight. I thought the TB would be my answer, but also have looked at new HT options.
Hightower 2 adds 1.5lbs to my same build.
HT 3 adds 3 lbs
I tested a 2024 tallboy and felt like it was the same bike as my 2018 HT- but did notice the reduced travel.
2024 TB can weigh 29.5 lbs in cc xo rsv. (Heavier than my outfitted 2018 HT)
Tested HT3 and it felt good, definitely more down hill orientation. Boosted confidence for gnarlier steeps. But, felt the weight increase for all around trail riding.
After riding 2024 TB and 2024 HT, I have an opinion. The 2018 HT is a lighter weight 2024 TB long travel. It’s just a fantastic model still. I haven’t found anything to replace it.
Santa Cruz, this can be your new model for 2025.
Why are we seeing these weights increase? Can’t we get adjustments in geometry, better engineered materials, better performance and keep weight the same or reduced?
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Posted on July 2, 2024 at 9:49 pm
Lloyd says:
Hi Daniel
I also had a Hightower 1 that I loved. When the HT 2 came out I thought it would be an improvement and so bought one. But after 2 years of really trying to love it, I never did, for all the reasons above in the TB shootout. Instead I went back in model time and bought a Hightower LT with coil shock which has all the great things i loved about the HT 1 but with more travel. So I have the TB 3 and Hightower LT and can’t see that changing as they are perfect for the riding i do – nothing i have ridden since has been an improvement.
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Posted on July 16, 2024 at 6:35 pm
Paul says:
Thanks for this review Lloyd.
Interesting what you explained about the sizing, despite a long reach you don’t feel stretched.
Can I ask you how tall you are and what’s your inseam?
Thanks.
Jak
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Posted on October 1, 2023 at 6:29 pm
Lloyd says:
Hi Jak
I am 188cm and 33 inch inseam
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Posted on December 4, 2023 at 7:49 pm
Eliav Derman says:
great review . SC are keeping the trend .Had more or less the same feeling when changes the TB 2 to TB 3 , going up felt heavier , going down is great fun .yet looking for my new bike and don’t have a clue …any suggestions ? I do spend long days on the saddle so marathon geometry is not an option .thanks in advance
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Posted on October 5, 2024 at 5:36 pm